Home > All Posts > Sort by Topic
Topic #17917

150 – Group Tipping Point?

By Michael Verdi | Michael Verdi <michael@...> | filmguy1105
July 22, 2005 | Post #17917 | Topic #17917

So I've been reading The Tipping Point by Malcom Gladwell which is a fascinating book. I just finished the chapter about groups of 150. For those of you who haven't read the book here's a quick summary of this idea via, http://tinyurl.com/45rhj THE MAGIC NUMBER 150 "There seems to be some limitation built into us either by learning or by the design of the nervous systems, a limit that keeps our channel capacities in this general range (i.e. the human minds inability to comprehend things beyond sets 7)" George Miller "The Magical Number Seven" "The figure of 150 seems to represent the maximum number of individuals with whom we can have a genuinely social relationship, the kind of relationship that goes with knowing who they are and how they relate to us. Putting it another way, it's the number of people you would not feel embarrassed about joining uninvited for a drink if you happened to bump into them in a bar." Robin Dunbar, 1. Even relatively small increases in the size of a group [beyond 150] creates a significant additional social and intellectual burden. 2. The rule of 150 suggests that the size of a group is another one of those subtle contextual factors that can make a big difference. 3. Peer pressure is much more powerful than a concept of a boss 4. Transactive memory: we store information with other people. Since mental energy is limited, we concentrate... [View]



Re: [videoblogging] 150 – Group Tipping Point?

By Michael Sullivan | Michael Sullivan <sulleleven@...> | sulleleven
July 22, 2005 | Post #17921 | Topic #17917

------=_Part_2562_19646329.1122045446315 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline [ Attachment content not displayed ] ------=_Part_2562_19646329.1122045446315 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline [ Attachment content not displayed ] ------=_Part_2562_19646329.1122045446315-- [View]



Re: [videoblogging] 150 – Group Tipping Point?

By andrew michael baron | andrew michael baron <andrew@...> | hamletphase
July 22, 2005 | Post #17926 | Topic #17917

I was supposed to shut up. It was my way of saying: I can see that I have been saying too much; unbalanced in context of the whole. The Magic Number being what any group 'tends' towards. With even 5000, perhaps, a fluxuating 145 will always speak up, and the rest, not. So as hard as I will try, I will leave again now for awhile, just in response perhaps to this, though as always, my intent is for something I believe: See here how all humans have problems and they come out QUITE CLEARLY in text, often more-so than in video! Look here I am again talking when I know its time to shut up. We all (150 at any time) do have these problems, Cheryl Shuman, I'm also talking to you. So take the cue from Ro, and get back here and lets stop all this nonsense and I look forward to seeing what everyone says about VIDEO! Over, [static] Maybe its been at 145 for a long time and will stay at 145 for a long time. Because some will speak u On Jul 22, 2005, at 10:46 AM, Michael Verdi wrote: > So I've been reading The Tipping Point by Malcom Gladwell which is a > fascinating book. I just finished the chapter about groups of 150. > For those of you who haven't read the book here's a quick summary of > this idea via,... [View]



Re: [videoblogging] 150 – Group Tipping Point?

By Richard | Richard <richardshow@...> | richardshowvlog
July 22, 2005 | Post #17930 | Topic #17917

First I wanted to post so that I have two this month, and will be counted i= n the group ... actually I wanted to point something out, that may be miss= ing from all these conversations (though I'm sure others are thinking it). = I love this group and I still get a lot out of it ... the positive, for me= , still far outweighs the negative ... first of all, you can ignore the emo= tional/flame war threads if you want, but I admit I read them and watch my = emotions and feel human and sort of enjoy it ... if nothing else what a gre= at video Mel made that resulted from all the commotion ... I strongly recom= mend it, if you haven't seen it ... it's a classic ... http://melslife.org= /archives/2005/07/20/dr-phil-can-you-please-help/ .. this video, to me, de= monstrates a great attitude and perspective - by emphasizing the humor it d= iffuses all the built up drama our minds create - the thing is, none of it'= s real, it's just our minds, it's just life, it's funny, and we (including = me) have an unfortunate tendency to identify with the drama our mind creat= es, rather than just watching and appreciating it ... ... anyway, this lis= t is a bunch of very human humans, sure, but it's still great and I wouldn'= t think about un-subscribing for a second - unless I... [View]



Re: [videoblogging] 150 – Group Tipping Point?

By Michael Verdi | Michael Verdi <michael@...> | filmguy1105
July 22, 2005 | Post #17931 | Topic #17917

On Jul 22, 2005, at 10:17 AM, Michael Sullivan wrote: > so, you feel that the group is undergoing some passive-aggressive > social dilemma here? So for me, here's the point - when I joined this group at the end of November last year there were about 125 people in the group and probably 25-30 regular posters. It was intimate. It was like a small group of friends. To me it feels like it remained this intimate group of friends (though getting bigger every day) until about 6 or 8 weeks ago. Since then we've had a series of unpleasant events around E.L. Woody, 59 Bloggers, Adam Kontras, and Cheryl Shuman. I've definitely played a roll in this and have been trying to understand my own behavior and that of the group. At the same time I happen to be reading this book and notice a connection. I point it out only because I think that understanding something is the first part of gaining some facility for controlling it. I would love to see this group head back toward that feeling of an intimate group of friends rather than this kind of nasty free for all we kind of seem headed toward. So I point out this thing about 150 people just to say, maybe asking people to be more civil isn't going to be effective, maybe there is something else at work here. I don't have any answers. On... [View]



Re: [videoblogging] 150 – Group Tipping Point?

By Markus Sandy | Markus Sandy <markus@...> | apperceive
July 22, 2005 | Post #17932 | Topic #17917

good points Eric Rice has posted an interesting video related to this http://blog.ericrice.com/blog/_archives/2005/7/21/1060030.html i think he's also speaking to all of us "quite clearly" markus andrew michael baron wrote: >See here how all humans have problems and they come out QUITE CLEARLY >in text, often more-so than in video! > ... >We all (150 at any time) do have these problems, Cheryl Shuman, I'm >also talking to you. So take the cue from Ro, and get back here and >lets stop all this nonsense and I look forward to seeing what >everyone says about VIDEO! > -- My name is Markus Sandy and I am app.etitio.us http://apperceptions.org http://spinflow.org http://spinsummer2005.blogspot.com http://spinsummer2005meetup.blogspot.com http://vloggercuewest.blogspot.com aim/ichat: markus.sandy@... msn: msandy@... skype: msandy [View]



Re: [videoblogging] 150 – Group Tipping Point?

By Chris Baudry | Chris Baudry <chrbaudry@...> | chrbaudry
July 22, 2005 | Post #17937 | Topic #17917

------=_Part_1777_4932395.1122049969714 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline [ Attachment content not displayed ] ------=_Part_1777_4932395.1122049969714 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline [ Attachment content not displayed ] ------=_Part_1777_4932395.1122049969714-- [View]



Re: [videoblogging] 150 – Group Tipping Point?

By Chris Baudry | Chris Baudry <chrbaudry@...> | chrbaudry
July 22, 2005 | Post #17938 | Topic #17917

------=_Part_1781_881900.1122050082789 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline [ Attachment content not displayed ] ------=_Part_1781_881900.1122050082789 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline [ Attachment content not displayed ] ------=_Part_1781_881900.1122050082789-- [View]



Re: [videoblogging] 150 – Group Tipping Point?

By Stephanie Bryant | Stephanie Bryant <mortaine@...> | mortaine
July 22, 2005 | Post #17945 | Topic #17917

Chris, dude.... everyone on this list is a narcissist, to one degree or ano= ther. Anyway, some possible sub-groups that could evolve out of this one: = 1) Vlogger-newbies: Make sure a core handful of "old-timers" spanning a br= oad range of technical expertise stay in the group and keep their eyes open= to questions and help people out. 2) Vlogger-politics: Vlogs in the polit= ical sphere 3) Vlogger-press: Vlogs in their relationships with press/mass= -media (ex: Cheryl's Hollywood insider types of vlogs, but also the Vloggin= g Press Kit) 4) Vlogger-legal: Legal issues/wrangles relating to vlogging = (ex: a site reusing or distributing your work without permission or site hi= ts, CC discussion, litigation, legislation, etc.) 5) Vlogger-tech: Talking= about changes in technology, bleeding edge, etc. 6) Vlogger-compose: Disc= ussion of the non-technical part of vlogs: public speaking, composition of = the shot and the video, editing choices, movie length, etc. 7) Vlogger-cha= t: Side BS that has not much to do with vlogging, but is interesting noneth= eless. And a possible 8th: Vlogger-reviews: People post commentary about t= he vlogs they're watching, or reviews of vlogs, just as long as it doesn't = become a critique group or a recurring "OMG, Verdi is teh bestest!!!" (i.e.= , re-reviewing the same vlogs over and over and over). I think a 9th would = eventually evolve, but probably not be called vlogger-, but rather "cellvlo= gging" for the video-camera-phone vloggers.... [View]



Re: [videoblogging] 150 – Group Tipping Point?

By Charles HOPE | Charles HOPE <charles.hope@...> | pokkarichuck
July 22, 2005 | Post #17949 | Topic #17917

--------------030402080702030804040500 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit andrew michael baron wrote: > I was supposed to shut up. It was my way of saying: I can see that I > have been saying too much; unbalanced in context of the whole. Personally I would prefer that you didn't shut up. I quite enjoy reading your posts. --------------030402080702030804040500 Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=utf-8; name="charles.hope.vcf" Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="charles.hope.vcf" [ Attachment content not displayed ] --------------030402080702030804040500-- [View]



Re: [videoblogging] 150 – Group Tipping Point?

By Chris Baudry | Chris Baudry <chrbaudry@...> | chrbaudry
July 22, 2005 | Post #17950 | Topic #17917

------=_Part_1915_6277333.1122052223863 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline [ Attachment content not displayed ] ------=_Part_1915_6277333.1122052223863 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline [ Attachment content not displayed ] ------=_Part_1915_6277333.1122052223863-- [View]



Re: 150 – Group Tipping Point?

By pomoartchick | "pomoartchick" <annewalk@...> | pomoartchick
July 22, 2005 | Post #17951 | Topic #17917

sounds like you're talking about a forum, stephanie. that's a really good idea. yahoo groups are great for small groups but not so great for large ones. a forum structure would be very beneficial. also, every forum i've ever been on always has a social thread for off topic fun. it's important here to keep a lid on the socializing because of the structure of yahoo groups but i think it's important to be able to relax and get to know one another socially as well. anne http://8bitme.blogspot.com http://nopractice.blogspot.com --- In videoblogging@yahoogroups.com, Stephanie Bryant <mortaine@g...> wrote: > Chris, dude.... everyone on this list is a narcissist, to one degree or another. > > Anyway, some possible sub-groups that could evolve out of this one: > > 1) Vlogger-newbies: Make sure a core handful of "old-timers" spanning > a broad range of technical expertise stay in the group and keep their > eyes open to questions and help people out. > > 2) Vlogger-politics: Vlogs in the political sphere > > 3) Vlogger-press: Vlogs in their relationships with press/mass-media > (ex: Cheryl's Hollywood insider types of vlogs, but also the Vlogging > Press Kit) > > 4) Vlogger-legal: Legal issues/wrangles relating to vlogging (ex: a > site reusing or distributing your work without permission or site > hits, CC discussion, litigation, legislation, etc.) > > 5) Vlogger-tech: Talking about changes in technology, bleeding edge, etc. > > 6) Vlogger-compose: Discussion of... [View]



Re: [videoblogging] 150 – Group Tipping Point?

By Chris Baudry | Chris Baudry <chrbaudry@...> | chrbaudry
July 22, 2005 | Post #17952 | Topic #17917

------=_Part_1935_5342425.1122052474728 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline [ Attachment content not displayed ] ------=_Part_1935_5342425.1122052474728 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline [ Attachment content not displayed ] ------=_Part_1935_5342425.1122052474728-- [View]



Re: 150 – Group Tipping Point?

By David Meade | "David Meade" <david_meade@...> | david_meade
July 22, 2005 | Post #17953 | Topic #17917

--- In videoblogging@yahoogroups.com, Stephanie Bryant <mortaine@g...> wrote: > Anyway, some possible sub-groups that could evolve out of this one: > 1) Vlogger-newbies: ... > 2) Vlogger-politics: ... > 3) Vlogger-press: ... > 4) Vlogger-legal: ... > 5) Vlogger-tech: ... > 6) Vlogger-compose: ... Yeah, I was thinking the other day that this had grown large enough that a more forum-style board (where posts can be grouped into sub-topics) would be helpful. Maybe thats a good topic for vloggercon :-) - Dave http://www.davidmeade.com [View]



Re: [videoblogging] 150 – Group Tipping Point?

By Jack Nelson | Jack Nelson <jack@...> | mexiculture
July 22, 2005 | Post #17954 | Topic #17917

If we split out all of the tech guys, whose gonna help the newbies? I say do all of this a s a last resort. Jack, who is now well above two entries this month On Jul 22, 2005, at 11:54 AM, Stephanie Bryant wrote: > Chris, dude.... everyone on this list is a narcissist, to one degree > or another. > > Anyway, some possible sub-groups that could evolve out of this one: > > 1) Vlogger-newbies: Make sure a core handful of "old-timers" spanning > a broad range of technical expertise stay in the group and keep their > eyes open to questions and help people out. > 5) Vlogger-tech: Talking about changes in technology, bleeding edge, > etc. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/videoblogging/ [View]



Re: [videoblogging] Re: 150 – Group Tipping Point?

By Michael Verdi | Michael Verdi <michael@...> | filmguy1105
July 22, 2005 | Post #17955 | Topic #17917

Oh man. I just wanted to point out a correlation I saw. I'm not sure that we need to break apart this group in a zillion pieces. We've had a number of discussions in the past about other groups and message boards and after a whole bunch of back and forth emails we come to the conclusion that we like this list the way it is (I think we've concluded this at least 3 times in the last 8 or 9 months). That's not to say that things don't change. There are several other lists - there is an RSS list, a business list, and a content list. I'm subscribed to the content list but there hasn't been an email there in months because they just end up here. FYI, Verdi On Jul 22, 2005, at 12:14 PM, David Meade wrote: > --- In videoblogging@yahoogroups.com, Stephanie Bryant <mortaine@g...> > wrote: > > >> Anyway, some possible sub-groups that could evolve out of this one: >> 1) Vlogger-newbies: ... >> 2) Vlogger-politics: ... >> 3) Vlogger-press: ... >> 4) Vlogger-legal: ... >> 5) Vlogger-tech: ... >> 6) Vlogger-compose: ... >> > > > Yeah, I was thinking the other day that this had grown large enough > that a more forum-style board (where posts can be grouped into > sub-topics) would be helpful. > > Maybe thats a good topic for vloggercon :-) [View]



Re: [videoblogging] 150 – Group Tipping Point?

By Andreas Haugstrup | "Andreas Haugstrup" <solitude@...> | andreashaugstrup
July 22, 2005 | Post #17956 | Topic #17917

On Fri, 22 Jul 2005 18:54:16 +0200, Stephanie Bryant <mortaine@...> wrote: > Anyway, some possible sub-groups that could evolve out of this one: And before someone goes out and creates all these groups keep these things in mind. - The forum vs. e-mail discussion has surfaced more than once. If you haven't been around that long it would be helpful to go back and read the old threads. - One split-off happened with the videoblogging_content group. The result was that many messages were cross posted between the two lists. What precautions do you propose so this won't happen again? - Andreas -- <URL:http://www.solitude.dk/&gt; Commentary on media, communication, culture and technology. [View]



Re: 150 – Group Tipping Point?

By Steve Watkins | "Steve Watkins" <steve@...> | elbowsofdeath
July 22, 2005 | Post #17957 | Topic #17917

Heres my summary of the forum idea, incorporating some past points by various people: Forum idea good because: Better seperation of topics in all sorts of ways People can chat without causing the whole group too much traffic Good search facilities Scales up to more users/posts better than a single list User interface & other features could be better than yahoo (or could be worse) Forum idea bad because: Some people like email and dont like forums (eg wont remember to go to forums) Some people dont want topics to split Some people Not everyone will rush to use the new forum and so this list may continue to be main hub of communication and the forum remains barren Someone has to host it/set it up (probably not a problem) Personally I favour forums but I wouldnt even try to convince peopel to switch unless the forum system used offered the ability for people to receive messages by email in an intuitive way, and the thing generally looked good and offered people feature incentives to switch, otherwise it may fail or split the community. Cheers Steve of Elbows --- In videoblogging@yahoogroups.com, "Andreas Haugstrup" <solitude@s...> wrote: > On Fri, 22 Jul 2005 18:54:16 +0200, Stephanie Bryant <mortaine@g...> > wrote: > > > Anyway, some possible sub-groups that could evolve out of this one: > > And before someone goes out and creates all these groups keep these things > in mind.... [View]



Re: 150 – Group Tipping Point?

By Zadi | "Zadi" <karmagrrrl@...> | karmagrrrl
July 22, 2005 | Post #17958 | Topic #17917

It's an interesting study in sociology. I've been a member of the group since I think October of last year, and you do see a difference. Even though the numbers were steadily increasing, there wasn't much change in the way the members of the group communicated with one another. Then, yes, there did seem to be a spike - a tipping point - a bubbling over, or whatever you may want to call it. It's almost as if our brain cells can handle a fixed number of information. Like there is a certain line where realizing the similarities turns into noticing the differences. (...Wondering if this is how early settlers feel. How tribes form. How wars are started. How peace may be inevitable as long as we are human beings (this is where we should strive to rewire ourselves) ---- talk about off-topic. :)) Forums have come up a number of times. It's coming up regularly now. Maybe it is a viable option at this point. I know I scan this list pretty fast, just to make sure I don't miss important info, but I don't feel as connected to it as I used to be. I belong to a couple of other forums and there is still a sense of community. You just feel like you're traveling from room to room, rather than trying to shout in a big convention hall. Maybe a forum could work symbiotically with the... [View]



Re: [videoblogging] Re: 150 – Group Tipping Point?

By Andreas Haugstrup | "Andreas Haugstrup" <solitude@...> | andreashaugstrup
July 22, 2005 | Post #17960 | Topic #17917

On Fri, 22 Jul 2005 19:52:56 +0200, Steve Watkins <steve@...> wrote: > Someone has to host it/set it up (probably not a problem) It will become a problem. Bandwidth costs for high volume forums are not to be underestimated. Remember that there is a lot more "fluff" on a webforum than in an e-mail, and that every time someone wants to read a message in a forum the entire thread has to be loaded. And you left out the most important point. It is very hard to figure out what's new and what's old in a forum compared the a mailing list. There's a lot of clicking around and reading old messages to find the new ones. And forums are "dumb" in the sense that they will mark off all new messages are "seen" even if you just pop in for a second to read one new message. I cna think of a few ways to make forums more "clever", but I'm not going to program a whole forum-package just for this (I also don't want to pay the bandwidth bills). - Andreas -- <URL:http://www.solitude.dk/&gt; Commentary on media, communication, culture and technology. [View]